Trivia Inaccuracy[]
I was looking at at the trivia section and I'm a little puzzled by this:
- Unlike the Silver Age Kathy Kane, who was written as being romantically attracted to Batman, the new version of Kane is written as a "lipstick lesbian." Her homosexuality was announced at the same time as the character was revealed in the spring of 2006. Stories appeared on television news outlets such as CNN, general news magazines such as "USA Today", and gay culture magazines such as Out. While many LGBT characters in comics are public with their sexual orientation, Kane is an example of a closet homosexual; one who makes a conscious effort to conceal her sexuality by any means. Renée Montoya, Kane's former lover, hinted during 52 that Kate's inhibitions were the reason behind their break-up. Kate's homosexuality is ironic because the original Batwoman was created purely as a love interest to help end rumors that Batman himself was homosexual, perpetuated by Fredric Wertham's book Seduction of the Innocent.
There are a few things there that don't make sense. While I will admit I haven't had the chance to read 52, I'm confused by the labeling of Kate as a 'closet' and 'lipstick' lesbian. In fact, Batwoman: Elegy makes it pretty clear that Kate and Renee broke up because Kate was frustrated with Renee being closeted (among other things) and she even publicly dances with Maggie Sawyer; she also goes on a date with a woman and in Batwoman #1, she publicly flirts with Maggie and then arranges a date. That all makes it pretty clear that she is no longer in the closet. The comment about being a lipstick lesbian does not entirely fit either. While she is literally a lesbian who wears lipstick, she does not dress in ways that are extremely feminine and she certainly isn't sexualized in the way that lipstick lesbians often are in the media. If anything, she's more butch than ultra-femme. May I suggest editing this paragraph for accuracy, or even just deleting it? --DreamPunk 19:56, October 7, 2011 (UTC)
Creator Issues[]
We seem to be in a bind here. SForHope maintains that Bob Kane "created the concept" of Batwoman, but does not source that claim. I maintain that writer Edmond Hamilton and penciller Sheldon Moldoff created her (Stan Kaye as inker is arguably not in the picture, so his removal is fine with me). Several references known to me aside (for example, a Batwoman Hero History in an old Amazing Heroes issue and a Who Did Who? feature by Bob Hughes in a Silver & Gold issue, both supporting Hamilton/Moldoff), this is the first time I am hearing about Bob Kane being involved in that particular character. Certainly, he does not ever mention her in his self-congratulatory 1989 autobiography, Batman & Me. So, where does that tidbit come from? --Lucien61 (talk) 07:15, December 4, 2014 (UTC)
- The source I used was the Les Daniels book Batman: The Complete History. I couldn't find an online source, but IIRC around pages 18-20, the author points out that editor Jack Schiff suggested to Bob Kane that he create more supporting characters for Batman, a bat-family. Under Schiff's direction, Kane proposed the idea of a Bat-woman, female counterpart of Batman and Sheldon Moldoff with writer Edmond Hamilton created and developed Batwoman. Every other online source (Wikipedia i.e), credit the character to the three of them. There are many cases in which a creator was not part of the team who wrote and drew the character's first app, but they were involved nonetheless. -S.S. (talk) 07:49, December 4, 2014 (UTC)
- Thanks for - well, may be not clearing this up beyond any doubt, but enlightening me to another perspective. Print sources are quite fine with me; in fact, I prefer them to the whims of the net. However, Les Daniels may not be the most objective expert since he wrote that book and others to order from DC (which was always more concerned about maintaining the Bob Kane Lone Creator partyline). But it is a good alternate point of reference, anyway
- I got involved in Bat-lore (and, by extension, creation lore) back in 1989 when, in the wake of the movie, a lot of various non-DC sources sprang up with a distinct contending slant against Kane As Lone Creator. And despite the anecdotal Schiff/Kane meeting I cannot shake the impression that Kane may have picked up the phone later, saying "Yo, Ed, write a Bat-woman, will ya? Schiff said so. And tell Shel to bring the art over by Friday. I need to sign the splash page before turning it in. Give my regards to Leigh." By the mid-fifties, he was very un-involved with the comics and had Hollywood itches. --Lucien61 (talk) 09:34, December 4, 2014 (UTC)